Andrew: Now today we have a special interview show. Our guest is an expert in automating income streams from scratch and we have a lot we want to ask him about that, especially with how consultants can take advantage of that.
Now just before we get into it, Kenny, why are you so excited to talk about this, this whole automation angle?
Kenny: Well, I think we’ve been looking at automation. I think it was the last week’s show or the week before that we looked at it and it is just becoming so, so important to get it right, to get your funnels right, to get your sales funnels right, your marketing funnels right and to get as much automated as possible, because we’ve mentioned time and time again we’re getting hit with so much information, which means there’s so much first to do as consultants.
So if we can automate some of that, then it frees us up to do what we’re good at and that’s helping other people.
Andrew: I will tell you what. Your competitors are automating and if you’re not, then they’re having a much easier time of it than you are. So this is something you really want to pay attention to.
Our special guest today is Daryl Urbanski. He is the Founder and President of BestBusinessCoach.ca and he’s best known for his ability to, as I said, create large seven-figure automated income streams from scratch.
He’s a Canadian who have moved out to Southern California and other places and now back in Canada currently. Daryl has quickly climbed the entrepreneurial ladder, getting respect from thousands of small business owners worldwide and he has helped so many of them directly.
He’s an author, a speaker, a marketer, a coach. He has got a multifaceted business approach that really sets him apart and we’re very excited to get to interview Daryl today. Daryl, welcome to the show.
Daryl: Hey guys. Thank you for having me here. It is an honour and a pleasure to chat with you guys.
Andrew: Well, thank you for being here and we definitely want to do some deep dives into really a bunch of the areas that you specialise in that can really help out consultants. Just before we do that, can you give us kind of a lay of the land from a 20,000-foot view? What is your business all about, the areas that you most help people and especially as it pertains to consultants?
Daryl: Sure, sure, sure. Well, the easiest way to describe what I do is I just – I say I help businesses with websites generate leads and sales and really my focus has just been on – like a lot of people probably listening to this call, they’ve tried a number of different things in business. I’ve done a lot of different models from the franchise model to being self-employed, a consultant, or like a number of different things.
So really what I wanted to focus on though is just what are the most important things you can do in a business. I wanted to be the equivalent of a franchise player in business and that’s focused on growth, on moving that needle, on moving the bottom line.
So really that’s kind of where my story started in just trying to figure out how to make this business thing work and then slowly figuring out, “Oh, that made money. Let’s do that again. Hey, that made even more money. Let’s do that again,” and just really focusing on those things.
So there are only three ways to grow any business whether it’s a consulting firm or your service business or even if you’ve got product sales and that’s to get more customers, to get more new customers, to build your customer base.
The second way is to get them to come back and buy from you more often because everybody knows most businesses need repeat buyers or “regulars” to survive and that’s by getting them to come and purchase again and again and again.
Then the third thing is to get them to spend more money when they buy from you. So really if I were to try to encapsulate what I do, I really just focus on those three things. In a pool of marketers, I would introduce myself as a direct response database automation marketer.
Andrew: Direct response database automation marketer. I love it. Very descriptive and you say that focuses on those three areas. As you’ve really gotten into this, do you find that any one of those areas is where most people are really lacking or especially need help?
Daryl: Well, it’s tough to say because when you talk to anybody, they almost always think that they have a traffic problem. I need new leads. I need more leads. I mean even that – I put three books up on Amazon and the one I’m most known for is the one on Ancient Secrets of Lead Generation. That’s the one that took off.
So everyone just thinks they need more leads but oftentimes, they’re not following up and they’re not upselling and they’re not trying to take care of their clients and customers. I’m as guilty as anybody. I mean Seth Godin has a quote where he’s like, “How would you run your business if you were unable to generate any more leads from this day moving forward? How would your business change?”
You can never generate another new lead. Today was the last day you were ever going to get a new lead and now to grow your business, you had to make do with what you got. I think that that’s probably a huge, huge hole in a lot of people’s businesses is because we live in a kind of a churn and burn society, especially if you live in a large urban centre.
I mean there are so many people, like next, next, next. It’s easy to just pass people along and that’s – but the funny thing of it, that is when people start feeling more like a serial number, right? And less special and it’s almost the opposite of what we want. We want close, tight-knit personal relationships and – anyway, so that’s basically – I mean the hardest thing to do is to get new customers. It’s the hardest and the scariest thing and most people depend on referrals or word of mouth to grow their business and that’s OK.
If you get enough traction and you get enough like content and you just get your roots out enough and you go to enough conferences and you build your network and you publish enough stuff, you can kind of generate kind of enough of a flow of that to survive on and sustain, but you can’t grow it because it’s not – you’re not in control of that if I’m making any sense here.
You can’t really control word of mouth. You can’t – you know what I mean? You can’t wake up today and be like, “I would love three referrals today,” and just go get them. You can’t do that. So you’re very much dependent and that’s a lot of the inbound marketing. Everyone wants to be on inbound marketing. Inbound marketing is great. I’m not against it at all but you can’t grow a business. You can’t scale a business like in a timely fashion with inbound marketing exclusively, which is kind of what that concept is. It’s waiting for referrals and waiting for people to hear an interview like this.
Someone may listen to this and reach out to me and that would be inbound marketing, which is great and it’s something that – it’s almost like anything. You need to breathe in but you need to make sure you also breathe out.
So I’m going on a bit of a tangent here but I think you need to do both. I think you really do need to do both because outbound marketing, you can scale like you couldn’t believe. I mean how else are you going to get nationwide coverage unless you can afford to do outbound marketing? Do you know what I mean? Like that’s just – and so it just depends on what your goals are in your business. But I digress. Sorry. I’m kind of going on a rant.
But yeah, for a lot of people, I would say that’s probably one of the biggest mistakes that they make is either they’re not going deep enough with their customers or they’re basing – they’re letting their business growth be left up to kind of the “powers that be” based on – if I run in this wheel hard enough, fast enough, long enough, maybe enough will trickle back in and …
Andrew: Yeah, I get what you’re saying. It’s – I think we tend to focus on things that are easy if we don’t know an area well. It just feels like it should be easy to get leads. It should be easy to reach out and get more people coming into us and as you said, that’s where a lot of people tend to begin and end their focus. But much more valuable usually is what you do once you get those leads and how you can develop and nurture that over time.
Daryl: Right, right, exactly. I mean if you have one client that stays with you for three years, paying you a couple of hundred bucks a month even, you know what I mean? Like, you don’t need a lot of those to have a really good, substantial, sizable living. But if you get a client and they stay with you two months and disappear, that’s where again it’s – it’s not because they’re dissatisfied. Maybe they were satisfied. They were satisfied and then they left.
But you didn’t go deeper. You weren’t – you didn’t find new problems while you already have the client with you and it’s not for the sake of charging them more money. It’s for the sake of hey, let’s take a look at all the dark corners of your business and make sure that you – if we take a house analogy, let’s make sure that your roof doesn’t leak and that all four corners of your basement are dry. Do you know what I mean? So let’s – doing those things and almost for the service of your client.
Then again there are 101 different ways to skin that cat. I mean OK. But if that’s stepping into something you’re not an expert in, it’s outside your expertise, OK. But then do you do a referral where you refer them someone else and get a finder’s fee or anything like that?
All these things really comes down to just trying to help your client as much as you can. If it costs a certain amount of money to get some concrete and fix that crack in the wall and for the labour, then that’s just the way it is.
I mean when you call up your friends, invite them for the movie, you’re not like, hey, you got 30 bucks to go see – you know what I mean? Do you have $30 that you can – you don’t talk about that. You’re like, “Hey, want to go see a movie?” Do you know what I mean? The money is just what it’s going to cost to get it done.
Daryl: Anyway, that might be a good thing for some people to think about. I mean right now, anybody, anybody listening to this call, I can guarantee – I will 99 percent bet my life on this. If you’ve been in business for any amount of time and you’ve got an empty calendar that you would like to fill, if you went through and took all the people that have ever paid you any money for services, like for your services or your consulting or your information and you did some sort of promotion to them, and them exclusively for them and made sure that you knew it was because you’ve done business with them in the past, I can almost guarantee you would get more business next week.
Kenny: It’s amazing you should say that because I had a client over in my office recently and if you know me, I don’t do too much consulting. I’m mainly a business coach for consultants. I had a client over and we analysed his client database. All the people he had done business with, just like you said, Daryl, and he didn’t have a clue as to how much business some of his clients had brought.
When we analysed that data, the 80-20 rule was there on steroids. There were some clients there that had given him so much money. I said to him. I said, “Have you ever taken this one, this particular client out? Have you ever taken this particular client out for lunch?” He’s like, “No.” He has never even taken him out for lunch.
He has got a bunch of clients who he just – he thinks he has done and dusted with them. They spend a lot of money with him and he just wants to focus on getting new clients. So he’s like, “Kenny, I just want you to help me with lead generation now. We just want to generate some leads.”
I’m like, “Whoa, whoa, whoa! Let’s look at your existing network and let’s look at what kind of money they have brought in,” and when you analyse it, when you look at it, it is staggering how the 80-20 rule works. We just pulled out the top 20 percent of businesses he had ever worked with and that will keep him busy for the next month getting back in touch with them.
It’s like the old saying goes and it’s – this figure has been bandied around. I think Salesforce came out with it recently. It costs around about six to seven times less to retain a client than it does to generate a new client. I think that is really important.
Daryl, just on kind of – we’re talking to you at the moment. But just some of the listeners might not understand exactly what you do and what you could do for them. Would you be described like me as a business coach?
Daryl: Yeah. I mean – so I’ve got – yeah, sure. I mean I will just be very candid. So for a lot of people they hired me. I’ve worked a lot with information marketers or coaches and consultants that are trying to scale. So I’ve got a couple. They do college planning and they’re probably one of the most successful in the States at what they do and they want to be able to scale and grow that and turn it into a membership site. That way they can have more automation, more freedom. They don’t have to meet people face to face in the office.
So I do consulting with people like that. So it’s a monthly thing. Month to month, we kind of meet and do that. I got some bigger done-for-you packages that are $50,000 to $100,000 where I come in and actually help automate the business and streamline things. So all of a sudden, you don’t need as many staff or just the business runs on its own. The business can run itself.
But I’m not doing as many of those anymore because the part of that frustrates me. I’ve done three or four of those. But then I – there are things I’m unsatisfied with in my own business and so now I’m more focusing on myself and I’m just looking to just publish some of my own products in that. I mean really the position I’m in right now is I would love to make some how-to products for how to do some of the stuff that people would like to hire me for, but either can’t afford my rates or just they want to do it themselves.
Daryl: And then take some equity positions in a few different businesses because I feel like I’ve got the skill set and I flex the muscle and I know what I’m doing. So I think ultimately what I would like to do is just have a six-figure-a-month business with educational products and then get involved in different either charity projects or businesses that I could take for a percent of equity and then just be the virtual VP of marketing or whatever for that company and just do what I do for them.
So it’s a blend because I mean there are all sorts of cool marketing automation tools that are coming out and with the marketing automation, you can also automate a lot of product fulfilment in that as well. Not everything but I mean it depends on the business model. But a lot of times people are astounded by the – to the degree that you can automate and anyway, that’s kind of it. I’m just about leveraging – I mean I’m a martial artist so I’m all about leverage.
Like I said, so my focus is understanding what makes businesses grow because that’s about helping people. I mean if you want to get really, really deep, I mean I was an orphan as a child. So my kind of modus operandi is just wanting to be included and belong and part of that is by being useful, helpful, valuable and so that’s kind of my end goal. That’s part of why I got good at what I got good at is – because helping businesses.
I mean some of the businesses that I’ve worked with, I mean their products and their services and what they do for people is phenomenal. So my theory is like if a business is a black box, like take a dentist office. You’re crying. You’re in pain. You got this massive toothache. You walk in one side. You go through the black box. You come out on the other side smiling, happy, pain-free.
So if your business is like this black box that solves a problem for people whether it’s as a consultant or as a carpet cleaner or whatever, as a dentist, whatever that may be, your goal should be to get as many people through that black box that are a good fit because you’re changing lives and you’re helping people.
So anyway, I digress. Go back to what you’re doing. I was doing more services. I’m stepping away from the services and getting into more products but I do do coaching on the side because – well, it’s awesome. I mean I’ve got a client. I’m helping him. He went from $10,000 to $38,000 a month. I mean that changes life. He proposed to his girlfriend. They have a wedding. They’re going to Mexico for that.
So it’s a very fulfilling thing. So it’s kind of where I’m at right now. I don’t know if that was a clear answer.
Kenny: Yeah, it was very clear and so it looks to me like you’re looking at automating your own business more, so you’re going to create some products that will benefit a lot more people en masse than what you can do by just being a consultant right now. Obviously jump onboard with certain businesses that you think have got potential on probably a non-executive director type of role where you attend board meetings and help them out virtually and get a piece of that business as well.
So I mean that sounds really exciting and that’s some of the things I’m doing with my business at the moment. So it kind of mirrors that really. But I think me and Andrew were talking before the call as well. When we spoke to you before we actually pressed the record button today, some of the stuff that really kind of interests me as well is you’re big into your kind of charity work and some of your stuff you’ve done for charity as well. Does that play a big part in your life? Can you tell the listeners some of that kind of stuff about how you’ve travelled and stuff like that? Because I think that is just – some of the stuff you told us before I think is awesome.
Daryl: Well, thank you. I appreciate that. Yeah, I don’t know. It’s just – it’s – I did this program when I was 17 Katimavik. It’s a Canadian government program. They actually stopped it, which is a real shame. Basically for kids 17 to 21, they put a group of 10 and 11 of you together, half boys, half girls. You’re supposed to represent Canada. So a certain percent comes from the West Coast. A certain percent comes from the East Coast. A certain percent speak French and you’re like this hodgepodge group and then for nine months, you travel Canada. You spend three months in three different provinces and each province that you’re in – province is like a state.
You have a fulltime volunteer job and then evenings and weekends, the group of you are basically signed up instantly to volunteer for whatever community event is going on. So I did soup kitchens, parades, cultural events. Like, you name it. We did it.
Anyway, after coming out of that, I just – yeah, I had just done a ton of volunteer work during that and after that. I just think it’s a fabulous thing. One, it gets you involved in your community. Two, you can change lives and really help people. I mean at the end of the day, you can’t – whatever you have in your bank account, you can’t take it with you.
I mean this is a side tangent. But I’m back up in Canada and the city where I kind of grew up in, Kingston, Ontario, and my parents’ next door neighbour passed away. I think it was the 7th, the 6th or the 7th of February. His funeral was on Valentine’s Day and yes, I know it’s sad and XYZ. But we all have role models for different things.
It’s really funny because I was – I saw Doug on the Saturday. I saw him on Sunday and then I went and saw him Monday and he had been battling leukaemia for seven years in the day when he finally passed.
I went and I took him to coffee, three cream, no sugar, and I hung out there and he was really tired. He wasn’t talking a lot and I remember sitting in the room and he’s in the house that he raised his five kids in and they all have grandkids and I realised there were over 20 people in the house. There are 11 grandkids between them and in that house, like on the wall are all these like, “Get well soon grandpa,” drawings, stuff like that.
So at the end of the day, I mean really – you know what I mean? Like life is about chasing your dreams, following your heart and helping other people. That’s definitely a big part of how I lead my life. I’ve worked with United Nations, helping with Invisible Children, which is a non-profit for child soldiers, building awareness, with Joseph Kony in Uganda. I’ve actually gone to Uganda.
I’ve done a ton of things. I mean even just Katimavik alone, ton of – it’s an important thing. One, it gets you to flex that muscle. I mean that’s even part of how I develop my skill. I’m on a bit of a tangent here but that’s even how I develop some of the skills.
I will go to conferences and join mastermind meetings and read books and reach out to people. But then I would just volunteer to help them in their business. Like, I didn’t want to get paid. I mean I want to get paid but I didn’t ask for pay, right? All I wanted was the opportunity to be involved in the project.
Man, the things you learn and the connections that you get and the skills you develop. I mean it’s – if you want to be able to do 100 push-ups, you can jog. You can eat right. I mean eating right is important for sure. But jogging, chin-ups, all that stuff will like help. But just do the push-ups and so it’s the same thing with this.
If you want to help grow a company, grow a business, then – you know what I mean? Like you can only really focus on your own projects so long and so I would just get involved on a lot of different projects. That would help keep it fresh, keep it moving.
So again, just try and tie this back into your listeners. I mean volunteering is huge. It is a fabulous way to network. It’s a fabulous way to practice your skills with resources that you may not have available.
I mean I remember one of the first ad campaigns I did. It was a $4000, $5000 a month marketing budget and I didn’t have the money to spend that in my own business. That would have terrified me, right? But hey, whatever, I’m volunteering, right? So it wasn’t left unsupervised but anyway, that’s …
Andrew: I think that’s a great way to think about it because I’m sure a lot of us feel like gosh, we have so little time already. How can I possibly find time to volunteer and donate my services?
But there’s so much that comes with it. I don’t do nearly as much as you have but I do go over and donate my time to help MIT start-ups, to guide them through their marketing challenges.
Daryl: That’s awesome.
Andrew: And they don’t pay me for that. I don’t get any equity for that. It’s just I’m donating my time. But in addition to the experience that you get from working with so many different types of folks, it just feels good. It just feels good to be able to help people out without expecting money in return all the time.
Andrew: So I think it helps grow our spirit a little bit, which can be a good level of energy to get us through the rest of the business.
Daryl: It’s so true and there’s a book called The Science of Getting Rich and it’s really – it’s like a one-page kind of statement and then it’s broken down paragraph by paragraph. It’s kind of how the book is.
If you just read that last statement, it talks about one of the things is you need to be in a creative mind frame. You can’t be in a competitive mind frame because when you’re competitive, you’re rigid, intense and tight.
So what you just said about how like you’re – you do some of your best work when you’re relaxed and at ease. There are so many projects. Like that’s even why I do the coaching and consulting that I do do. It’s because I learn so much from my mentees. Do you know what I mean? I learn so much from my clients in that because I will come and look at their business and their problems and so just like you say, “How do you find the time?”
I don’t know if you have the time. I don’t know if you – what’s that saying? I don’t know if you can afford to not volunteer because it will get you out of your own project, get you out of your own state of mind, and again, it will get you to look at things creatively and there are so many times where I volunteer and help someone else and be like, “That is amazing. I’m going to do that for my business.” I will go and do that for my business and because I already did it once, it took like a third of the time to do it the second time.
Daryl: So I think there’s just a ton of value in that, a ton of value in that. The reality is, is that anyone that’s listening to this call, like if you’re – like all right, I’m self-employed. I’m an entrepreneur. I’m going to be a business owner. That’s who you have to be and I say this a lot because I think it’s really important.
I was fortunate enough that in my career and in my life, I’ve been fortunate enough to train with a lot of world champions and Olympic athletes when I was in the martial arts more intensely than I am now.
I went to a conference and the guru had put on the wall, “If you want to be broke, hang out with nine broke people.” I was like, “Forget that! I’m going to be rich and hang out with millionaires.”
I did. I met 12 millionaires in the next 12 months. I met 12 millionaires and one of the things that I’ve recognised that’s kind of the same between all of them, especially in the athletes, is that when they go to the world championships, when you got to the Olympics, you’re not going there hoping to be ordained world champion. You’re not hoping that someone else is going to give you permission to be world champion.
You are already going to be world champion when you get there. Do you know what I mean? Like you’re just – that’s just the day everyone else finds out about it.
Because what that means that when you get there, you’ve got a world championship training schedule, world champions diet. You’ve got the training – the coaches, the training partners. Your life is so optimised for performing that thing that you already are that person when you get there, if that makes sense. That’s just the way – you know what I mean? That’s like the test of trial by fire. There’s no way to deny it when you put it down to competition.
I think a lot of people are non-committal and I think that’s why more people aren’t successful because they would much rather watch their TV show than read the book or to volunteer their time. Do you know what I mean?
Andrew: Well, I think that mindset of being a champion already. I’m sure that’s necessarily to get to the level of success that you’ve seen. You mentioned before that you charge around $50,000 for a few-month website project. I know you charge around $500 or so for an hour of consulting.
I think our listeners would love to hear about how you were able to get yourself to that point. I’m sure you started from more humble beginnings like all the rest of us. But what is the mindset required and what were the – what did you have to do along the way to really get to that level of success?
Daryl: Yeah, that’s an awesome question and I have got a great answer for everyone listening here. So there’s something called the income-earning ladder. OK?
So you have a pyramid and the bottom rung are generalists. So when you’re a generalist, you make as much as a generalist can make in your profession. If you’re a dentist, you make what any dentist can make.
Above the generalist, we have specialists. Now you’re an orthodontist, right? You’re specialised. You can charge more money because you’re specialised at what you do and to get someone who’s expert at that, you have – right? Like you just – we all get it. Now you’re special. So you can charge more than the generalist.
The next rung up from that is a trainer of specialists and a trainer of specialists can charge more than a specialist because there’s a confidence their clients have that they are going to get like cutting-edge, industry-leading service, right? They’re going to get access to cutting-edge information or industry-leading service because as a trainer of other specialists, you should know all the best practices. So I will pay a premium for you to do it versus someone else because you should know everything that the other guys may not know and you will do it, right? So it’s a greater certainty and outcome and I will pay for that.
Then people who make more than trainers of specialists are the celebrities. So Dr. Phil is not the world’s greatest counsellor or psychoanalyst or psychotherapist. In fact a lot of them might talk smack about him behind his back. But because of the law of supply and demand, if you were to auction off an hour of his time, he can make a phenomenal amount above what anyone else does.
So that’s kind of the income-earning pyramid and to climb that ladder, you need to go through those rungs. You need to be a generalist and here’s the thing about evolution that’s really cool is when you evolve, the way that you evolve is you are so much the thing before that it’s like a cup of water overflowing, that you overflow into the next thing.
So that means that you can’t neglect any of those – like those smaller skills that you need in that trait. You have to be so – like so competent that you are more than competent at that level. Generalists, specialists, trainer of specialists and celebrities.
So for myself, it’s because I have walked that path. I speak at events. I speak at conferences. I have people that come to me for coaching and training or turn to me to teach others what I’m teaching them. So I’ve got that trainer of specialists and the people that are willing to pay me those fees, oftentimes the people that are willing to part with that money is they’re people who have met my clients and seen the results that they’ve gotten and that type of celebrity is hard to replicate. At that point, it’s just – what is my time worth to build your business versus my own?
That’s even what I talked about when I went on my rant a little bit earlier. It’s kind of why I’m not doing that as much anymore is because it’s great. I invest three, six, eight months in building your business and creating this little asset. But then when I’m done at the end of the day, I’m like, hey, I just traded dollars for hours again and I’ve done this for multiple people. It’s like the shoemaker with holes in his shoes. I’m like I need to get my own thing up and running and then maybe think about doing this for other people.
But in the beginning, I was volunteering to figure out how to do it and then was charging a fee to do it as a business and then I was proving myself and hitting milestones and helping generate over $3 million in less than eight months. Do you know what I mean? Like doing these kinds of things and then all of a sudden doing projects for their friends and helping other people all of a sudden have half a million dollar months.
Then now it’s like all right, I’ve got the skill set. It’s great. I can sell my time to do it. But man, I would really like to have my own. So that’s where I’m turning to now and anyway, does that – I hope that’s helpful.
Andrew: Oh, yeah, completely.
Daryl: So a celebrity could be manufactured as well. I mean you’re a celebrity anytime there’s a group of people who look up to you for something. You just can’t abuse that power. I mean if you go to church every day and you – I don’t know.
You’re the CrossFit guy. You work out a lot. You’re a celebrity at the church that you go to because you’re in better shape than everyone else. You know what I mean? They’re like – they know you for that. That’s kind of like an expert thing. But when enough people believe in you as an expert, that’s kind of where celebrity comes in or enough people hear of your accomplishments. Suddenly there’s like folklore. There’s like legend of what you’ve accomplished.
I say it’s a legend because they’ve heard of it but they don’t know how well they can trust the information. That’s kind of what legends are. A legend is a phenomenal story that we don’t know if we can necessarily believe or not because we don’t – we’re not close enough to it. That’s kind of – again, you just build that ladder. Just go from being a generalist. Specialise. Once you specialise, hang out with the trainers and then start seeing if you can start training other people, even if it’s for free just to get the experience.
Then when you’ve got those things accomplished, then you can – I mean it’s almost like an academia, right? You work your way up and then you contribute to the body of knowledge and that contribution can turn you into a celebrity or just getting a ton of exposure for the results that you get.
Kenny: Yeah, very, very clear. Now just I would like to backtrack a little bit if you don’t mind Daryl just to – before when we talked about inbound and outbound, I know some of the listeners will really want to get some clarification around that. I’m just wondering if you could give some specific examples of strategies that you would use if you were a one-man band independent consultant out there right now who is looking to go beyond – he or she has taken that bit of information we said before and they’ve talked to their existing clients and done all of that kind of stuff.
Now they want to generate some new clients and scale their business. Can you give some different examples of what you have used in the past for both inbound and outbound?
Daryl: Yeah, that’s a great question and I’m going to preface that with a story of kind of about how advertising and my philosophy on advertising and how is advertising involved because back in the day, all of us that were engaged in business were – in any respect where there are consultants or service provider or we had a product to sell, we all were just kind of sales reps with a horse and buggy going from town to town, knocking down people’s doors trying to sell our wares.
That’s really kind of what it was at some point. There were merchant routes, travelling caravans and all that stuff and we get this one ambitious business owner, sales rep, whatever you want to call them, and he wants to have a family and get his wife the nice dress she wants and pay for his kids to have everything they want and the best education and maybe his parents aren’t so healthy and he wants to be able to get the best doctors they can afford and he’s determined to get through more doors in a day.
I’m going to get through more doors in a day and he’s knocking as fast as he can and trying to go through without cannibalising his face time with people and he realises every time he knocks on the door, he kind of goes through the same spiel because he’s meeting new people and he’s going through the same kind of introduction.
He realises maybe if I can just write this down into a letter and I can pay a boy to run ahead of me and deliver the letters to the doors before I get there, when I get there, I will spend less time at every door.
He starts doing that and after he does that for a while, he realises, hey, a lot of these people are – I’m just showing up and collecting money. Maybe I don’t even need to go. So he adds an order form to his letter and now the boys are running out and coming back with payment and fulfil the order forms. Now he’s just pulling into town and paying a bunch of boys to go and distribute his letters and come back with orders and giving them product to go and deliver that and then just moving on to the next town.
That’s kind of how advertising developed and that’s the – like that’s really – and that’s direct mail is one of the purest forms of advertising and online marketing, internet marketing which is kind of all the craze now is just a digital form of direct mail marketing, which is an evolution of what I just described too there.
Just play with that idea. It’s a scenario of how it involved because I think that’s really an important thing because in your business, you need to meet new people. Word of mouth is waiting for the people you know to tell new people they’ve met or a new discovery in the people they know, right?
Oh, really? You’re having a problem with that? Maybe you should talk to my buddy Joe. He’s great with that stuff. They’re waiting for those things to percolate, right? They’re waiting to just – again, to meet people in happenchance. But if you want to grow your business, you have to proactively do two things.
You have to proactively go out and meet new people and you then have to proactively take these new relationships and turn them into regular customers, repeat business. That’s where the marketing automation tools are the most powerful. So you’re talking about inbound versus outbound marketing. The outbound marketing is going out and meeting new people in a way that you can do without going bankrupt, right?
That’s where you hear about things like self-liquidating offer or a loss leader in a lot of companies where they sell something like video game consoles. They sell them and they actually lose money in some instances selling the console. But it’s because they just need to get the console into your hands because they know they’re going to make that money when you buy the 50 different games at 40 bucks a pop, right?
So again, so anyone that’s trying to figure this out, I mean those are the two ways to grow a business. You can wait for people to come to you or you can go out and you meet new people and get them. Then if you want to meet new people, there are a lot of different ways to meet new people. You can meet them one-on-one. You can go knocking on doors. You can hang it out at the table at the mall and just wave at people that walk by.
You can somehow get involved at a conference and go up on stage and say hello to hundreds and potentially thousands of people and say, “Hi. My name is …” and introduce yourself to them that way or you can pay to run advertising to them.
So there are a lot of different ways to reach out but it’s about meeting new people and deepening the relationship with the people that you have. There are only two ways to communicate with someone and that’s to make the – build loyalty in the relationship, to build depth to the relationship or to create profitability from the relationship.
But something you have to remember with that is when you’re walking down the street and you see the guy who tried to sell you a car you didn’t buy, you cross the street. You’re like, “Hey, what’s happening?” You cross the other side of the street where he isn’t.
But when you walk down the street and you see the guy who sold you the car that you’re driving, you’re super happy to see him. So in a lot of ways, that’s where – when it comes to selling, that’s where we almost just want to let people guide themselves. You want to let people – I don’t want to go too far down the rabbit hole. But when you’re selling, it’s consultative especially the consultant. It’s letting them come to their – nobody wants to be sold. We don’t want to buy stuff.
So anyway, to digress from that, but go back to the inbound versus outbound. Those are the two ways and if you get to the point where you know – I have this process that I go through when I meet a new person because there are friends for a reason, friends for a season and friends for life. When you meet someone and the reason is that I want to have a friend who I pay money, who helps me with this, whether – I want to pay someone to go to the gym with me and watch me workout, make sure I don’t hurt myself, that is – you are friends for that reason.
As long as you’re friends, that’s the reason for your friendship. They’re not your drinking buddy. They’re not – you know what I mean? They’re not your barbecue buddy. They’re your friend for that reason and so nurture that relationship.
Again that’s where we get into what we talked about before, deepening that relationship, making more offers, finding more things to help them, even if you’re not the person that’s going to help them with it. You can get a finder’s fee or just be valuable to them for providing the introduction, right? So again, it’s just that value.
So if you want to grow and scale your business, how are you going to meet 1000 people overnight profitably? Do you know what I mean? That’s where when you get to a place where you can use paid media – and it doesn’t matter if it’s Facebook. It doesn’t matter if it’s Google Ads. That stuff doesn’t matter. The principles – the tactics frequently change so that’s whether it’s direct mail or Facebook or Google or whatever.
The tactics frequently change. The strategies sometimes change but the principles never change and that I learned from Dan Kennedy and I think that that’s just phenomenal and again, that’s – why aren’t more people’s businesses growing? Well, they aren’t meeting enough new people because there’s only so many hours in a day and they go to the occasional conference and they meet whoever they meet. But then how long does it take them to nurture those relationships?
Most people don’t have a plan for how to do that. They don’t have like – and even when they do make a plan, a lot of times with my clients where they mess up is they put on this professional speak face. I think formal education ruined a lot of great entrepreneurs in some ways and I don’t mean that – I think education is important. I’m an avid, avid student. I spend easily 50 grand on my own education at least a year. Just books – whatever, coaching, whatever. Like I’m – but I think that people get into this mindset where they’re trying to appease their instructor or their professors and pass tests and they’re forgetting what the real goal is.
So when I talk about what I just talked about, that you have to make a plan, a lot of people when they go to do their writing, like copywriting, they put on this professional mask and they want to be a professional. So they write like a professional but that’s not a relationship-building message, if that makes sense.
In fact, if anything, that’s keeping someone at an arm’s distance because you know you’ve got a client and a repeat client and what you could call a “regular” when they’re like my drycleaner, my hairstylist, my coach. Do you know what I mean? Like when they talk about you in that way and when you have someone that you talk to – my friend who owns – my buddy who owns this restaurant and then when you talk with someone that you have that kind of rapport with, there’s no – you know what I mean? You don’t have that professional mask on when you communicate with them. Does that make sense?
Kenny: Yeah, yeah, it makes sense. It makes sense. I just want to kind of – it makes a lot of sense. You’ve kind of given some people some overview. You’ve given the listeners some overviews there of what to be looking at, what principles to totally keep your eye on. Obviously I was after some – probably a few tactics that you’re using right now that are working for you and working for your clients right now. But are you saying that’s – it’s totally specific depending on the client or do you have some clear winning strategies that are winning right now? Clear winning tactics I should say that are winning right now for you.
Daryl: Yeah. I mean a great strategy would be to provide free content to create a pool of people interested in that topic and then sell them something related. So basically it would be like if you put bird food out in your backyard every day, the birds would start to come and every day that you put food out, there will be more and more birds.
After a while, you have a critical mass of birds. I have all the birds that are available in the area and then all of a sudden, in a business sense, if you’re like, “Hey, thanks for coming today. Here’s your bird feed. If you’re thirsty, you can buy some water. It’s a dollar a bottle,” and so that’s a great strategy. Marketing via free content is a great strategy for a lot of people because it’s not seen as salesy. It’s helpful for a lot of people and it gets them to the next step that they want to get in and then it creates that audience. Then it helps you figure out who’s interested in what information.
I mean again the best model I think I just like – a marketing funnel is an ad to some sort of lead capture device that leads to a follow-up to a first time offer, just to establish a relationship, the terms of the friendship, that we’re friends for this reason and so that’s – I mean that’s it. When you want us to ask for strategies, I have a couple of clients that they do speaking at high schools. I have other clients that are doing AdWords, other people that are doing Facebook and other people that are using direct mail.
But that’s the traffic. So the formula is traffic times conversion equals money. So you have a traffic source and then times conversion which is whatever your conversion and whether that’s just give me your name and email or give me your contact info or whatever that is, equals conversion. So if it’s the unknown universe and you just want to know who they are to “have leads,” then you have to have some sort of introduction for them, whether it’s a free info packet, a free kit, a white paper, a webinar, whatever you’re giving away, a book, free copy or book. Whatever that free thing is, now you’ve moved them from the unknown universe into your known universe where you know who they are and they are leads.
Now that’s your traffic base and now you want to convert them to the next stage and keep moving them up that process.
Andrew: Hey Daryl?
Andrew: Sorry, go ahead and finish your thought on the tactic.
Daryl: No, no, no. I was saying the tactical thing, it just depends on what works best for your business because here’s the thing is that I don’t want a – prescription without diagnosis is malpractice.
Daryl: So I don’t want to prescribe anything but with what we’re talking about, I think that’s the best way to do it. So for you, you can use tools like – here’s a great tool for anyone that isn’t – that needs to learn how to use. It’s an autoresponder in business. Autoresponders are phenomenal because an autoresponder is not the email that you get when I email you and you’re on vacation. It tells me that you will be back in two weeks. An autoresponder is the calendar of emails that I can preload into software that will go out like clockwork and you can get very sophisticated tools that it’s basically like a Choose Your Own Adventure depending on what emails you open or what links you do or don’t click.
I mean really, here’s an example from when I had my martial arts school. People would sign up for a trial class. They would get automatic emails, pushing them to a calendar to pick which day they wanted to come in. Once they got picked, they got automatic emails, reminding them to come in for that date and then when they came in for that date, staff got an email with a couple of links in it to click saying, “Hey, did they show up? Yes? If they showed up, are they still in the trial? Did they buy? Did they sign up? Are they not a good fit or do we not want them?”
Then depending on what link the staff member checked, it put that person down a totally new path and series of emails and that’s one example of automation where instead of having to repeat and do the same thing over and over again, you just pre-plan it. You know it. You set it up and away you go.
Andrew: That level of automation not only obviously saves you a ton of time and prevents mistakes from you and your staff but it also gives your clients the best possible experience for them. I mean this is really what’s enabled by this entire automation approach.
Andrew: I would like to ask you a little bit more about that. You mentioned in the beginning that you really consider yourself someone who develops leads and new clients through website funnels and one thing that we’ve talked about quite a bit on our show is the need to establish yourself as an authority.
If you’re a consultant, you need to be in authority in some space or as you were saying, a specialist or a trainer of specialists in order to not only get new clients but command those high fees. I realise there’s no one-size-fits-all approach here. But from some of the things you’ve done and you’ve helped your clients with, what would be some of the top recommendations you would have for independent consultants who really need to better establish themselves as an authority online?
Daryl: Yeah, those people I would – I mean for them, it would be get involved in more projects. Have more people know your expertise because if nobody knows – like if a tree falls in the woods and no one is there to hear it, it doesn’t make a sound. If you’re the world’s leading expert at doing double back flips, but no one has seen you do one, it doesn’t matter that you can do it.
So if they’re not even an expert yet because then why should I – if I don’t know you’re an expert, why should I trust to pay you? I mean I’ve only got $100 for example, right? I only have $100 and I need to solve this problem. I need someone that can help me accomplish X. Why should I – I mean you have to be an expert and so the tip would be to get that expertise, to associate with people who are experts at that to volunteer and if you have to, to get the experience, to get proof, to get case studies that you can use to show other people and do – reach it, like interviews like this.
Anything where you can just go somewhere and show and tell the world, “Hey, here’s who I am. This is what I can do and this is what I’m good at.” Writing a book is huge. Writing a book does not take months and years like it does for some people. I mean a book – I think if you want to do like update – an updated version of your book, maybe that could take time because you want to make sure it’s perfect and all that. But a book is just a packaged up version of your knowledge and in the world today, you should be able to get a book done in a week. You can dictate it out. You can just record yourself rambling and have it transcribed and someone ghost write it.
There are 101 different ways and a book is a great, great, great tool to separate yourself from other people, especially in the expert world. You have to have a book. If you don’t have a book, you’re not an expert. You’re just a guy with opinions and ideas.
I mean if you have a book, you’ve put – you’re like, look, this is everything I know about this topic put into these pages and I’m publishing it, self-publishing it or getting a publisher. But most people are probably better off self-publishing for speed and control and just getting it done.
But now you put it out there and then people can argue that. They can contest it. They can do whatever. But you’ve got – you know what I mean? Like this is my body of knowledge on X and now that’s like some sort of – like what would the evidence of expertise be? It would be exactly that. It would be books. It would be packages of your knowledge and information. Your knowledge and information packaged up in different forms available to help the people plus case studies and testimonials and people who want to hear your words and opinions.
Daryl: You can’t fake that kind of stuff.
Andrew: Yeah. A book, as you said, people may argue it. They may contest it but the point is they’re talking about you. They’re talking about what you put out there, your authority, your authorship, and that’s what makes this so powerful.
Daryl: Right, right.
Andrew: And I imagine these may be related questions here. But another one that I’m sure lots of people will be interested to hear about is how you can get started getting passive income via your website. I know you focus on infomarketing which means obviously having some content there that you can package and sell like a book or something else. But what do you suggest to folks who haven’t done it before and really want to get – start down that road of generating passive income through their website?
Daryl: Right. So here’s – first of all, don’t focus on the money because if all you’re thinking about is the money, then you’re heading the wrong direction and the reason why I say that is because the passive income comes from automated fulfilment, which means that you – and automatically are making someone fulfilled with something and so the best thing to do is – I mean if you have a website and you would like to generate automated income and you just want to keep it as simple as possible, I would put a product up on Amazon and drive traffic to that and just keep track of my sales versus how much I’m spending.
I mean that’s the most basic way to do it because an – like a passive income stream basically means that the product is able to be delivered and fulfilled without your involvement and it also means that the money collection and processing part happens without any staff or anyone being involved other than the customer and that’s not difficult. You can set up on Twilio.com. It’s a phone service that you can use and you can help that – tie that to your – you can tie that to all sorts of systems and now you can collect orders over the phone robotically. People just call in. It’s an automated message. They put in their credit card info and make their payment information. Boom!
Now you have a passive way to collect funds, right? You can do the same thing with a website, the PayPal button. You have a passive way to collect funds but now you need to have a traffic source that sends people to it and then you need to be able to do something for those people worth money and that’s why I say don’t focus on the money first and foremost. Focus on helping people first.
Focus on something you can do to help people and that’s why I said the Amazon because the Amazon, it doesn’t matter what you put up. Are you going to put up a book? Are you going to put up a product? It doesn’t matter. You just put something up and hopefully you already have other competitors there. Because if you’re putting up a product that nothing else exists, how do you know a market even exists for it?
So I mean that’s just – that’s basically – when you talk about an online passive income stream – forgive me. I know you can hear the clock in the background. But that’s basically what it is. It’s where the fulfilment doesn’t involve you and so it can’t be a service business and the model has to lend itself to scale. So again, if you’re trying to develop a seven-figure income stream, you need to be able to take on seven figures with a business. Someone that’s just going to get started, just try to have a basic – a software as a service is a great product to get into if you have something.
Again, that’s the only way to do it. I mean a lot of people want something for nothing. They just want to be able to put some words on a page and open up a WordPress site and make money. But you actually have to solve a problem for people. And then once you know how to solve it, how do you automate the fulfilment? How do you automate the delivery?
I think it’s a phenomenal example of that. A lot of services businesses or consulting businesses can be automated with a membership site. That’s actually one really powerful way that some people have been able to do it. I’m just trying to think of other really tangible things.
Yeah. I mean for the most part, that’s really what it just comes down to. It’s just traffic times conversion equals money. So it’s just have a traffic source that you can use with some people to your website and make a promise with them that – like there are so many services that I’ve signed up for, great split-testing tools, Visual Website Optimizer, and I’ve never spoken to any reps there. I’ve never engaged with anyone from that company yet but it’s a software as a service. It does split-testing for headlines or sales pages, whatever you want.
I went and signed up and didn’t pay them a thing. So that’s – and that would be a passive income stream and the only reason why it wouldn’t be is because they are – one, they’re trying to charge as much as they can which means they have to have a certain level of customer service and two, they’re constantly trying to innovate that product. That depends on what you want.
I’ve got some businesses that they’re just going to die at some point because they’re going to be redundant. But for now, they’re nice little cash cows. It’s just – that’s the kind of game you play, if that makes sense or you build something just to sell it or – is that helpful at all? I don’t know …
Andrew: Yeah, I mean that’s the sort of thing that a lot of us would like to get towards and these really are the principles that we need to keep in mind for this.
Andrew: Now Kenny, did you want to ask anything else before we wrap up today’s show?
Kenny: Yeah, just one more question really for me is we spoke about how to automate your marketing here today. I just want to know a little bit more about – that clock in the background reminded me. It sounded like you were at a – sounded like you were at Notre Dame there. The bells made me deaf and it was three minutes early by the way. So I just want to know more, a little bit more about your actual time management best practices because I know that you’re very much into it, into time-chunking and calendar management and email management and all of that kind of stuff.
As consultants, we can all get bogged down with email taking over our lives and all of that kind of stuff. So obviously I don’t want to stretch you out too long here. But if you could just give us some really quick tips on that, that would be great.
Daryl: Yeah, no, no, no. That’s fine. I’m here to be of value to you and your listeners. So that’s fine. If we go over a little bit as long as you guys are OK, I’m OK. So time management is huge. If there was ever a secret between the successful and the unsuccessful, time management is – if it’s not it, it’s a big part of it and that’s because every day we all wake up with 24 hours ahead of us and at the end of the day, if it were a race, the person who’s going to be the farthest ahead is the one who uses their time better.
So time management is huge. I blocked my day into 30-minute segments. So Jim Rohn has a great quote. Never begin a day until you finish it on paper and every day I plan it out and so that’s a really important thing. You don’t always get to stick to your plan but you have to plan it out because otherwise you wake up and you just get taken by the day.
So I try not to resolve or deal with any problems that aren’t urgent and like need to be done now before 3:00 PM. I keep all of them until after 3:00 because I would like to focus on my main objectives for the day.
That’s basically in time blocks. So like email I think which you’re alluding to is I have an assistant. I don’t touch email. My assistant goes through my emails. She puts them into a Google doc and I read them and I answer them once a day.
I try to do the same with Facebook and social media. But that’s just really being – it’s having intent. So that’s basically it. I mean map out your ideal day. If you were your ideal person, who the person you want to become, what does their day to day life look like? If they had to just live one day over and over and over again, who would your ideal version of you be and what would their day consist of?
Map that out. Put it in a – like assign like numbers to it. Like at 8:00 AM, I’m going to be doing X for this much time. Then do it and stick to it and you’re going to fall off and it’s going to work for a while and then disappear and you’re going to get back on it. That’s just it. That’s the name of the game.
So time management I think is really, really huge and another component of that as well is understanding the value of your time. So the reason why I’m not checking my email is because – in no way is this meant to be a slight to anyone but when I have the capacity to make the changes in people’s lives like I have for some of my past clients and – well, clients and friends, the – spending an hour messing around, dealing with a couple of hundred emails a day that gets sent to my inbox is not a priority.
You get paid in relation to the size of the problems you solve. So if I just need to get across town and I have all day to do it, I can walk, which is free. I can take public transportation which is a couple of bucks or I can pay someone to drive me, which is a little bit more money or if I want the convenience to go wherever I want, whenever I want, however I want, then I need to buy my own vehicle and cover my own ongoing expenses.
So you could see it’s an echelon of greater costs because it’s a bigger problem that I’m solving, if that makes sense. I need to be able to do it in urgency, when I want, go when I want, come back when I want. It means I have – it’s a larger level of requirement. So again, everyone that’s listening to this as consultants, if you’re trying to move up the ladder, are you really the one that’s reposting on your Facebook or on social media? Are you really the one that should be reading all your emails?
What should you really be focused on if you were the ideal person that you’re trying to become? Because everybody has that because once you achieve it, now you want to become someone else. That’s more refined or whatever.
Andrew: I love that. It’s very similar to Perry Marshall’s take which is, “Are you focusing on $10 an hour activities or $100 an hour activities or $1000 an hour activities? Where do you want to be focusing?” If you don’t want to focus on the low pay activities, you need to find another way to have it dealt with.
So that’s a great tip. Check your email once a day. If you can, have someone else combine it and send you the important things. Wonderful ways to move up that ladder to get your focus on the high value areas.
Daryl: Right. I mean that’s exactly it and you can get as extreme as you want to that. I did an interview with a guy and he and I were talking about – he and his family were going on a road trip and he was considering having a driver so he could just work the whole way because those hours, if applied elsewhere, I mean he’s – in his first year, he did seven figures in his first year. He’s like, “Is it really worth it for me to drive for four, five hours or should I just pay someone and then do something that’s going to make me a couple of thousand?”
Daryl: That’s the mentality that we have there. In the beginning, you are the person that has to do it all. There’s a great quote. I would love to just mention this. Hold on. I’m going to Google this quickly. But I love the definition of entrepreneur. So when you look up “entrepreneur” in the dictionary, it says a person who organises and operates a business or businesses. What it doesn’t say is a guy who mops the floors, cleans the toilet, does the accounting, answers the phone, replies to all emails, right?
I love that. I got that from Brad Martineau. I did an interview with him and I love that so much and that’s – again, that’s what it comes to. So if you want to get top dollar as a consultant, then you can’t be the guy that’s cleaning the toilet. You can’t be the guy that’s reading the receipts. You can’t be that because then you’re not spending enough time to develop proficiency at what people want to pay you to be proficient at.
Andrew: Well, that may be the most valuable advice anyone could get out of this all day today. It’s what you need to do to focus on getting paid the way you want to get paid and get the business value that you want out of it.
Daryl, I feel like we could talk for hours here. I’m afraid we got to wrap it up, I’m sad to say. Let me ask. If anyone is interested in speaking with you after hearing this podcast, how can they best go about doing that?
Daryl: Sure. So social media, if you look me up, Daryl Urbanski. You can also check at our website BestBusinessCoach.ca. It’s for California or Canada, whichever you choose. The site is under development now but by the time you listen to this, it will probably be fixed.
That’s kind of it really. I mean I can give out my email address if they want to email, BestBusinessCoach.ca“>Daryl@BestBusinessCoach.ca”>BestBusinessCoach.ca. They can do that as well and that’s basically it. Just reach out. Just visit our site. Get on the list or just reach out in some way, shape or form and tell me what the problem is or what problem if solved would allow your business to explode or just that you got value out of this call. I love getting those notifications as well and that’s it. Thank you guys. I really appreciate your time today.
Andrew: Well, fantastic. One last question I would like to ask everybody. Who would you refer to come on our Magnetic Consultant Podcast next? Now that you’ve gotten a good sense of who our audience is, how we’re trying to help them out, who do you know that you think would be a great interview guest for us to have?
Daryl: Honestly, almost – I’m biased but I would recommend my best friend Jermaine Griggs. He is just such a ninja, so phenomenal. He started with $70 and he grew like a seven-figure empire that – he and I were joking the other day. He could – talk about automation. He could die – knock on wood – he could die and his family could still be making money. I mean everything is paid off for the next few years. They wouldn’t know how to shut off his autoresponder. They wouldn’t know how to take down his website. They would just keep churning and people would keep signing up and think he’s still like alive and doing well.
Yeah, he has definitely got a ton of wisdom. He has been through a lot of the lessons. He has done the consultant game. He has done the info business game. He has done a lot of it and I think he’s just the person – he’s just a great man. I’m very, very fortunate. He’s my best friend and yeah, I just – his timeless wisdom. So he would definitely be my number one recommendation.
Andrew: Oh, he sounds like a great fit. Would you mind doing a brief email intro for us after the call?
Daryl: Sure. I can do that.
Andrew: Well Daryl, listen. Thanks so much for your time today, for sharing all of your experience and expertise here. It’s a real pleasure having you on this show. That was Daryl Urbanski from BestBusinessCoach.ca.
Now Kenny, what do we have coming up for our next show?
Kenny: Well, it’s really timely because having spoken to Daryl today all about how to automate a lot more, automate your business a lot more, we’re going to be looking at how to delegate better. So we’re going to be looking at how to hire the right help in the best possible way.
Andrew: Yeah. I mean you can’t automate everything. You still need people for many things. When it comes down to that, how do you hire the right ones? So we will go on to that next week.