Andrew: Today, we have a very special guest on the show. He’s a value proposition and conversion optimization expert, and I’ll be introducing him in just a minute. But first, Kenny, why are we so excited to talk about this topic with our audience?
Kenny: Well, how often have we spoken about value propositions? We’ve done a whole show on it. We’ve brought it up in many different shows. It is so important to get your value proposition right. We’ve even debated between us what value proposition is. It’s not just the value proposition that we’re going to be talking about today. It’s how that ties into conversion, and also, I’d love to pick Peter’s brain on conversion rate optimization as well, and just some little tips and tricks in that area.
Andrew: That’s what we’re going to do. So our special interview guest today is Peter Sandeen. Peter is a value proposition and conversion optimization consultant, and a very prolific publisher on those topics.
In fact, that’s how I first got to know Peter myself. I found one of his online articles about value proposition and then I read another, then I read another because his writing is very persuasive, to the point, and clearly based on a lot of in-depth experience in the field. So we’re excited to have him here and eager to see what we can learn.
We also planned a special feature for today’s show. Kenny is in the process actually of relaunching his own website, Find The Edge. So after we engage Peter in some insightful Q&A and some good discussion, we’re all going to take a look at Kenny’s new site together and ask Peter so share his suggestions live regarding how he can better present his value proposition and improve his conversion rates on his brand new website. So it should be good fun and hopefully we’ll give Kenny some valuable nuggets to take away.
Welcome to the show, Peter Sandeen.
Peter: Hi guys. Thank you for having me.
Andrew: To start out with, I just want to give everyone a chance to get to know you a little bit. Can you just tell us a little bit about your background, how you got into this business, kind of what’s the history that lead you to where you are today?
Peter: I’ll try to keep this very, very short. So I started two businesses very early on, but in both cases, I kind of backed out before I really started to do much of the work in them. It took me a while to realize why. It was that I had figured out the marketing, without realizing that that was the fun part for me. I had done it. I had figured out how I’m going to get clients in both businesses. I had everything set up.
But then I lost interest and really, it took me a while to realize that the fun part was over, figuring out the marketing. So I started reading and studying even more of it. Pretty soon, people started asking me
questions about it because I was starting to write about it and share my ideas and I did, I helped a few friends for free just to have fun with it.
But very quickly, I just realized that it’s the most natural thing I’ve ever done. It turned into a business. This was I think about several years ago anyway. The first thing I really focused on was actually not too much conversion optimization, but copywriting. I have some big marketing professional clients and the results were really great, so it really looked like I’m going to be a copywriting.
But then I started getting into conversion optimization because I felt like if I can figure out copy, then why not figure out other pieces that actually affect conversion rates, what affects the sales rates. I was in conversion optimization. I am still in it, but it’s no longer my primary thing because after doing quite a few projects of conversion optimization, I realized that there was only one thing that’s consistently made the biggest difference. There was one thing that always made the biggest difference.
I started calling that thing value proposition, and my definition of it isn’t exactly what it’s often discussed as, but we’ll get to that in a moment. That’s basically how I got into value proposition from conversion optimization. I realized that while doing the conversion optimization, what always stood out as the thing that made the biggest difference to results was the value proposition and the way it was communicated.
That’s about it.
Andrew: That’s a great story. It’s actually not too different from mine, starting out in a different business, finding that I really enjoyed the marketing piece of it, willing to take on more of that. I’m sure a lot of consultants kind of side-step their way into their consulting practice. So it’s a good case study of what a lot of us can do, so as we get to learn more about your expertise, we get to see where we can take it.
By the way, Peter, mention where you’re from. We may have some listeners wondering about the accent.
Peter: I’m in Finland.
Kenny: Your language skills are phenomenal. Where did you learn English?
Peter: This is a funny story. When I was starting my business, the marketing business, I realized that I wanted to do international stuff mainly because of – this is a whole other story, but the marketing culture in Finland doesn’t really invite me to work mainly in Finnish or in the Finnish market. But anyway, I realized that I want to do international stuff. So I need to learn to speak English better.
At the same time, my then girlfriend – now my wife – wanted to learn to write better English. So we decided, okay let’s speak English for the next 6 weeks. That was about 5 or 6 years ago, and we still speak English to each other. That made a big difference. It just somehow caught on and we never switched back to Finnish.
Of course, I was also doing a lot of copywriting, so after one client who happened to be a professional writer – so she was very strict about grammar, after realizing that there were dozens of grammar rules that I have never heard of, that even professional editors haven’t heard of. I’m serious about that by the way. So I decided to really learn to write English right so I know if I’m breaking a rule. I found a great editor who basically taught me everything and that’s how I learned English.
Andrew: That’s got to be critical. As a copywriter, you absolutely need to be fluent in the language, do you not?
Peter: Yeah, of course. I was fluent, but I was not aware of things like – I think one of the things that I used in that specific project was saying that you “a plan leads you somewhere” and that’s incorrect. I still don’t really understand how, but apparently a plan cannot physically lead you anywhere. A plan just exists and that’s grammatically incorrect. So I’m really talking about nitty-gritty things that I had to learn.
Andrew: Which make up all the little nuances and important pieces of the language. And by the way Kenny, this reminds me, I wanted to compliment you too. Your English has come so far. You never speak proper, American English but good job mate.
Kenny: I love it when you come out with English-isms like mate. Peter, what inspired you to get into copywriting or who inspired you to get into copywriting?
Peter: I don’t think it was anyone in particular. I was wondering how do I get better at marketing. What’s the thing that I should really learn at some point? I had heard a lot of people say that copywriting is the thing you need to learn or if you learn to be a really great copywriter, then you’re a really great marketer.
I was like, okay I’ll go into that then. Then very quickly, just within a couple of months of starting to really practice copywriting, I had a big client job that made massive results, that were actually publicized as well. It just instantly, somehow I just got it. As I said, marketing is just the most natural thing for me. I have no idea why. I had never thought that I would be interested in marketing.
My parents, I think, still think that marketing is somehow evil. Really, that’s not something that I was expecting to happen but I had heard a lot of people say that copywriting is the thing you need to learn to be good at marketing. I was like, I’ll believe them and just study copywriting. It worked out very well.
But yeah, it wasn’t anyone in particular. I found some really great courses, went through them like a maniac. It just happened. I don’t know what specifically made it happen, except just wanting to get better at marketing.
Kenny: What courses were those?
Peter: There was one, I think it’s called American Writers Association, something like that. They had – it’s a little bit cheesily sold. I think it’s sold as this 6-figure copywriting course, like ‘How to make a living sitting on a beach somewhere and writing’. The content was really good. I took a few other courses, but that was really the one that stood out as the best one that I took back then.
Andrew: So Peter, let me move into asking about your core specialties here. So you mentioned value proposition, conversion optimization, how those two really go hand-in-hand and how you’ve learned how critical the value proposition is. Could you please, for everyone’s benefit, tell us how you define value proposition and what, in your mind, makes that so special and so important?
Peter: I think if you look on Wikipedia, the definition of a value proposition is something as vague as the value you provide for customers. It’s an okay definition, but it’s very impractical, I think. It usually leads
to these grandiose mission statement-type things that people say. Those can be useful in internal, executive decision-making and stuff like that, but how do you use that kind of thing in marketing? I don’t really see a way for it. Okay, there is some way of using it but it’s very impractical.
So the way I define a value proposition is that it’s made up of the ideas, the top ideas that are most likely to make your target customers want to buy whatever you sell.
Andrew: That’s very to-the-point.
Peter: Yeah. If you think about it, if you know exactly the top ideas, typically 3 to 5 ideas, they’re not necessarily as simple as ‘cheap price’. They can be more complicated than that. But if you know the exact ideas that are most likely to make people want to buy from you, you can make quite a bit of sale because all your marketing can then focus on the things that are most likely to make people want to buy. That’s really the idea behind it.
Kenny: Okay. So I’ve got a client and my client wants to know what a value proposition is, what are you going to say to them? Is it a document where you can pull information from for different areas of your marketing, whether that’d be your website or sales letters or whatever it may be?
Peter: You could say so, although a document I think refers to something that would be larger and lessto-the-point. A value proposition, the way that I develop it with my clients is it has basically two parts. The first part is almost always 3 ideas. They don’t have to be in the way that – you don’t copy-paste them directly into marketing. They’re just the ideas that you need to communicate. They’re the mostly likely to make people want to buy from you. That can take a few lines. Each idea can have maybe 20 or
30 words. So altogether, it’s 60 to 100 words.
Then the other part is the key ways to prove those points. But that’s kind of a different thing. Let’s keep that aside for now. It’s really just not that many words. It’s just 3 ideas, or sometimes 4 or 5, but usually 3 ideas.
So a document, yes, it’s really very, very simplistic. But that’s the point of it, that it only tells you what to focus on in all your marketing.
Andrew: Peter, I like this very simplistic definition you have. It’s very easy to think about. How specifically does it help a business? What’s a value to a business owner having these 3 clear ideas of why people want to buy from you? What does that do for your marketing, for your business planning, for everything?
Peter: It’s very overarching. Let’s say you’re making an ad, whatever kind of an ad. Instead of having to go through the whole process of, ‘What would I say to this one’, ‘Here’s a list of features and here are a few benefits’, ‘There is a testimonial’, ‘I guess our ad is ready’.
You don’t have to kind of hope that something in the ad might persuade someone to maybe, at some point, want to buy something from you. But instead you just look, okay these are the ideas I need to communicate. This is the first one, so I’ll communicate that one first. Now that I feel confident I’ve communicated that first idea in this ad, then if I have space left, then I’ll talk about the second idea. Okay, I have space left so I’ll talk about the third one.
Okay, I need a call-to-action. Again, the value proposition, what do I need the call-to-action need to be communicating for it to be as persuasive or desirable as possible? Just look at the value proposition.
It makes creating marketing much faster and a lot easier, and you’re also going to get consistently higher results than if you just winged it and just hoped that the ideas that you happen to talk about in this particular piece of marketing might persuade someone. It’s very much like, let’s just hope for the best, if you don’t have a value proposition and many companies do that. After you’ve done it for long enough, you might start to create this innate feeling of, well these types of ideas tend to work.
But that’s kind of vague. You’re never really focusing on the most effective things if you don’t know those most effective things. Of course, we can talk about lower ad costs, much higher conversion rates, more sales, more return sales, making marketing easier and faster, all these things. It can make a massive difference because you don’t have to guess, you don’t have to hope for the best because you already know what are the ideas you need to communicate.
Andrew: So it makes it easier and faster to craft the messaging for ads or whatever it is that you’re writing. I also imagine it just helps everything naturally align so much better, all your different marketing efforts, anything you’re producing and sending out there. It’s all going to focus on the same handful of ideas.
Peter: Yeah. Companies that have marketing teams for example, a big benefit for them is that their team is easily aligned on a very specific message. It also leads to a much better brand recognition because people don’t remember inconsistent – inconsistent marketing just isn’t memorable. You can’t build a brand of any kind around inconsistent messaging.
So if you’re after branding, then this is kind of the best branding tool. But it really depends on – the benefits you, as a business owner, see are whatever you’ve kind of struggled with because it helps with a lot of things. But eventually, the result is more sales because your marketing is more effective.
Andrew: I think a lot of business owners get the idea and understand that they should have a clear value proposition and often try to create one. But I’m sure you’ve seen many gone wrong, meaning it’s gone off to the weeds. Are there certain mistakes, do you think, business owners make quite often with respect to creating a value proposition, mistakes that we should keep in mind and try to avoid?
Peter: Yeah. There are actually quite a few. Maybe we’ll go through – I basically have a process for creating one and there are different issues people run into in each one, although people might not even remember to do all those steps. But even if they do, they run into different issues or mistakes. I think that might be easier. Does that sound oaky?
Andrew: Okay. Let’s step through your process, absolutely.
Peter: Yeah. So the first step is to figure out your target customer, and before anyone who’s listening to this thinks that they have done this, you haven’t. It’s extremely unlikely that you would’ve because this isn’t – there are a lot of ways to do target customer, or customer avatar or buyer persona, or these different things. Even though they can mean the same thing, people do them in very different ways.
So what you need to do in this specific situation is to figure out all the things about your target customer that affect what kind of a message is the most effective for them. What is the message or what things
affect them or what are the aspects of these people that affect what kind of message can be most effective for them?
One of the clients I did this with very recently, a marketing professional, got a list of 77 different aspects. Those all actually affect what kind of marketing will be effective.
When people usually do customer avatars or target customers or whatever you want to call it, they go into two different categories. Either they look at very, very specific things – they look at one individual specific imaginary customer. They might give a customer a name and an age, and find a picture to represent that person. They find the exact company they work in. They talk about their personal life. They have a list of all these things that describe maybe one specific ideal customer.
But for example, let’s say that the customer avatar includes the knowledge that this customer has two kids. Then how do you use that in your marketing if you’re selling packaging materials? You can’t use those things in your marketing. They can be useful in how you create your marketing if you can relate to the person and all these things. But it’s impossible to really create an effective message or value proposition based on those things that don’t affect what they are persuaded by.
The other way people often do it is with much more vague, more general things. They might say that okay, our target customers work in companies that have 50 to 100 people. Again, you can’t really use that in your marketing directly. Of course it can lead to other things. They might have different worries and different situations, and different budgets and all those things compared to much smaller or bigger companies. You can’t use the knowledge of their business size directly to make your marketing message effective. Or you can, but it’s not the most influential thing.
So as I said, the first step is to figure out your target customer and really figure out what kind of people they are and what are the things that affect the marketing message that will persuade them.
Andrew: Those are the two wrong ways to go about it, Peter. Then what is the right way?
Peter: You look for things like how do they want to solve their situation, whether it’s a problematic issue that they’re struggling with that you can help with or whether it’s a goal that they just can’t seem to reach, that you can help with. How do they actually want to solve it? What are the issues and what are the goals that really mean the most for them? You look at things like what are the competitors or what are the alternatives that they’re aware of and why do they like those and why don’t they like those?
You look at all the things that really make the decision making process of, do they want to buy from you once they’ve seen your marketing.
Kenny: I know some of the listeners here are going to be saying, okay great, sounds good. But how do I do that?
Peter: Most people can answer the questions when they just have the questions, just based on their experience about their customers, if they’ve had enough customers already. If they don’t, then there are a lot of ways to find it out. Depending on what you sell, of course, and who your target customers are, there are many different ways to go about it.
If you’re after high-level executives, you might need to do some formal research. You might even need to hire a company to do it for you. Or you can just schedule interviews with those people so you can just kind of prod them and figure out what are the answers to the questions you need to answer. There are a lot of ways to go about it.
The other extreme would be if you need to talk with, let’s say, teenagers are your target customers. Then just go to a shopping mall where teenagers like to hang out and interview them there, or go to a website where they’re likely to talk about related things to what things do sell.
There are a lot of ways to find the answers, but of course, it’s always better to have the direct knowledge of what people have talked about and what have been their greatest fears and hopes, and problems and goals and all that, just from your own experience of working with them that if you don’t have that possibility, then you can find out the answers. It might seem like a lot of work, and in some cases, it kind of can be but I don’t see any way around it.
Another way, which is easier to set up, is that assuming that you’re already building an email list, then as soon as people sign up to your email list, direct them straight into a survey. It can be a bit tricky to actually find the right questions for the survey so that you find the answers that are actually useful, because people in general are very bad at understanding their own behavior.
It’s surprising how badly we judge why we do things. But there are questions that we can answer pretty accurately. So yeah, there are a lot of different ways how you can find out those answers, even if you don’t have past customers to ask or your own experience to draw from.
Andrew: If we can move on to step 2 after you figure out your target customer, what comes next?
Peter: Then comes figuring out what are the benefits that are most meaningful for them. What are the benefits they most desire, the benefits they’re happiest to pay for and happiest to pay a lot for? What are really the things they want most? What are the benefits and outcomes?
I know everyone who’s listening to this has probably heard of the mantra of, ‘Don’t talk about features. Talk about benefits’. But I have yet to come across anyone who would actually do that naturally, including myself. I know that even in my own marketing, I still sometimes talk about features instead of benefits, because it’s so natural for us who understand our own stuff well, to talk about features because they just translate directly into benefits in our own minds.
The point is, the second step is to figure out what are the benefits they want most. And again, there are a bunch of questions you can answer that actually make it simple to find those. But it does take some time and it does take some work. But that’s the second step.
Andrew: Okay. And step 3?
Peter: Step 3 has two parts. The first part sets up the second part. The first part is doing some competitor analysis. The problem or the mistake people often run into when they try to do this is that they ask a lot of questions that they find a lot of answers to like market shares and how old their competitors are and how many employees they have, what their price points are and all these kinds of things, which are good to know.
But since the point of the third step is to figure out what differentiates you in your target customer’s eyes in a meaningful way, then the market shares and stuff just don’t really make any difference. So what you’re looking for in the first part is how do my target customers perceive my competitors and any alternative ways to get similar results to what I offer?
So for example, if you sell some kind of golf training course, an alternative way to get similar results would be to hire a golf coach. So even though you might not think of a golf coach as your direct competitor because they don’t see online courses, they are still an alternative way to get similar results. So you should consider them a competitor. That’s the first part.
The second part is finding the differentiators that make people understand that you offer them something different, something unique, the mistake that people run into here is that they think I do things better than my competitors. That’s not enough. Even if you do everything better than your competitors, people won’t perceive you as different. They might perceive you as a bit better but they won’t perceive you as different.
Of course being better is great, but that doesn’t make people choose you automatically. But if you’re different, it takes away most of the need for people to price shop or even look for alternatives or think of, well this other guy gives slightly cheaper prices so I’ll go for them because I don’t really see any difference in their actual product.
So that’s the third step, figure out what differentiates you in a clear, meaningful way in your target customer’s eyes.
Andrew: That is a piece that I know a lot of business owners struggle with. They’ll tell me that, I do think we do this a little better. We have great customer service but it’s pretty much the same product and pretty much the same service as our competitor. So how can we possibly differentiate ourselves and that seems to be a very common feeling companies struggling to figure out how can they actually differentiate. Do you have any guidance or tips to give there?
Peter: There are countless ways and a lot of the ways are not things people ever consider. In rare cases, you actually have to change what you do to be able to differentiate yourself. I do understand that that happens, but it almost never happens. It’s enough that you have more experience and stuff that provides a slightly different focused service. You can just focus on a different type of service or you can provide some additional help for your customers. You can even differentiate yourself by having a radically different type of marketing approach, or you can differentiate yourself with different types of payment options.
There are so many different ways, just depending on what makes you seem significantly and meaningfully different for your target customers. So it’s not really something that you should consider from your own perspective at all because that doesn’t matter. You’re not your own customer. But rather, think of what would make my target customers think that I’m different, that I’m unique, or that our products or services or our company is different and unique in a meaningful way?
Usually you can quite easily find it out. One of the best ways to differentiate yourself is to figure out what are common negative things that your competitors do, things that your target customers think are negative and very common in your industry. So for example, if you’re an internet service provider, then if you have great customer service and you can make people believe that you have great customer
service, then they will think that you’re extremely different because everyone knows that internet service providers typically provide very, very bad service.
So whatever it is that your target customers think are common negative things in your industry, just do the opposite and that’s basically all you need. Of course, there are other ways to do it, but that’s a great way to start.
Andrew: What I’m hearing here too is that you can’t just pick any old thing to differentiate yourself with. It has to be something that’s going to be meaningful to your target prospects.
Peter: Yes. That’s a very common mistake that people think that this feature, for example, is unique. It’s completely different or no one else offers this service in our industry. Well, it doesn’t make any difference unless your target customers think it’s meaningfully different, unless they understand that it’s unique and actually want to buy from you because of that unique aspect.
Kenny: I read a magazine article probably a year or two ago about this business that had grown massively. It had grown to a 9-figure business and the way they built their business is they just went on Amazon and they looked at all of the reviews, and they looked at the negative reviews. They would just build products that did the opposite of the negative reviews, and then put them on Amazon. They now have a team of 70 people going through all of the negative reviews. They’re just pumping products are that are the opposite of those negative reviews.
Peter: Yeah. That’s a great strategy. So the first step is to figure out what of the ideas you have gathered by then are believable. There are a lot of things you can say that people just don’t believe, no matter how true they are. So for example, let’s say you’re an internet service provider company, you have great customer service and you tell people we have great customer service, people don’t necessarily believe it at all because their experience is everyone says that they have great customer service and in reality, it barely exists.
So the step forward is to figure out which of the ideas people can believe and what does it take for them to believe those ideas. For example, the great customer service, you could prove that by showing people a few testimonials from customers who say stuff like, ‘I didn’t expect them to have any good customer service, but wow it’s phenomenal. They come to my house to fix things within an hour of an issue’, or whatever it is. You have to find out how to actually make people believe the things you want to tell, want them to believe because otherwise, those things don’t make any difference. If anything, they make your marketing worse because if people doubt one thing, just a little bit, then they’re going to doubt everything you say. Yeah, that’s the fourth step.
And the fifth step, just put together the things you find out in the previous steps and find the most impactful things. Combine things, improve things, just do whatever it takes to make them as impactful as possible for your target customers. Yeah, that’s the process, 5 steps.
Kenny: I love that fourth step as well because it’s about really taking a look at it and looking at what is believable. It’s so subtle, isn’t it, what is believable? And I love what you said there because if they don’t believe that bit, they’re not going to believe anything else. It’s like having a fly in the ointment at that point.
So it’s a really important step there, isn’t it, to really find something that is believable and then present some proof?
Andrew: Think about what people are doing often when they’re looking for a new service or product throughout their comparison shopping. There are so many options, especially online. What do you do?
You’d be overwhelmed if you don’t have some way to go through it, so what people naturally do is look for ways to disqualify candidates.
So you come to a website, oh he has a service I’m looking for, that claim seems a little bogus, alright, moving on. That can be all it takes, right?
Peter: Yeah. One thing that people doubt is an offer for them to never come back. Often, people try to deal with this, marketers and business owners, as an afterthought. They build their marketing, basically it’s all ready, and then they think, okay how do we prove these things? Then they just slap on the guarantees and more hype-y language, testimonials and stuff. That kind of works, but it’s not very effective.
It’s a lot better to go through the individual ideas that on a deep level you want to communicate with all your marketing. Consider if you can prove them, and if you can, then how? While you’re building your marketing, first of all, you’re only focusing on communicating ideas that you know you can prove. You’re building the proof into your marketing. It takes away a lot of the need for guarantees and testimonials, and all the stuff that people try to do as an afterthought.
Sure, guarantees and testimonials can be still good, but you don’t have to rely on those things when you have other tools for it and you thought of it on the level of the individual ideas.
Kenny: Very powerful. Can you give me an example of somebody who’s come to you, a client who’s come to you and they had a really poor value proposition and very quickly, if you could tell us what you did and how you helped them and how that transformed their value proposition, and any kind of results off the back of that.
Peter: One recent client, his name is Steve Horsman. He helps men who have basically issues in their marriage to just grow and do whatever it takes to improve their own life, and often that means improving their marriage as well, although that’s not directly the goal. The goal is to make the man feel good about who he is basically.
So he had been in his business for a very long time with very minimal results. When I started working with him, what he said after he approached his value proposition into his homepage and into his emails, he got more leads, more prospect calls and more high-end clients in the first 2 weeks than he got in the 6 months previous to that.
That didn’t actually take a lot of new leads. It was the same people in his list already, who just suddenly wanted to buy.
I can give you a basic idea of what the ideas are in his value proposition. I haven’t asked for permission to share anything exactly, but these are the things you’d anyway, understand. He offers mentoring for people who have already tried everything they can to get love and affection. The second idea is about how he guides people through a very specific process that makes them feel more confident and just get
respect and appreciation. And the third idea is about how he helps people create feelings of masculinity, presence, sexual tension, and all those things that women typically respond to.
That’s the value proposition, like I said, not exactly but you get the point. They’re not very complicated ideas but those are the things that his target customers are most likely to respond to.
Kenny: And was the message watered down before that, before he made it more…?
Peter: Like almost every company on the planet, it wasn’t really a specific message. It was rather that if any company creates 10 pieces of marketing, it’s very likely that all 10 pieces of marketing talk about different ideas.
The idea behind it is what I called “blanket forming marketing”, that you just try to say everything and anything you can think of in your marketing that might persuade someone to want what you’re selling. The idea is that if you’ll just get these benefits out there, then there’s the highest chance that someone notices something that they want and then buys.
That’s very inconsistent. You get lucky sometimes and someone buys something, but you don’t then really have a target customer so you can’t do targeted marketing at all. Since all your marketing is about different ideas, then anyone who sees more than a couple of pieces of your marketing will just get lost of what are you really about? What can I really get from you?
So even though they might, objectively-speaking, see more benefits, they’re still a little less likely to want them. They can’t really feel like you’re really the best choice that they have.
Andrew: That’s a great point. It’s about not having enough focus so that people really understand who you are and why you’re special.
Peter: Yeah. It’s sad how simplistic we humans are, that if we see that someone says they provide 10 things, it’s likely that we really want let’s say 2 of them. But since there are 8 things that we’re not that into, that are not interesting or important for us, overall, our feeling will then be just kind of ‘meh’. But if we only heard that they provide 2 things, the things that we really want, then we’ll be very excited to get those.
So just the fact that you talk about things that are not really important for your target customers makes them less likely to want to buy from you. It’s not logical, but I guess the logic is if they don’t focus on just these things that are really important for me, then that probably means that they do worse of a job on the things that really mean a lot to me.
Anyway, the point is, if you’re not focused, then people just can’t really understand what makes you good for them and they can’t see that you’re great for them.
Kenny: It’s great background noise of the stuff in there that isn’t going to resonate with them.
Andrew: You’re absolutely right. It may or may not be true that they would not be as good at delivering those two things, but they might be great at it, but it’s just the perception. If somebody specializes in
just 2 things, they’re probably better. It’s just going to be your instinctive reaction and that’s, I think critical for everybody to keep in mind, who’s trying to find a niche. It’s part of the importance of specializing, which we talked about so many times on this show.
Kenny: So that’s the end of the first part of this series with Peter Sandeen, where we’ve been looking at value propositions. On the next show, Peter’s going to talk about conversion rate optimization, why it’s important and how to implement it on your site. He’s actually going to go through my new design for my new homepage and completely tear it apart. So it’s going to be a great show, which I’m a bit nervous about, to be fair.